St Peter’s Church: A new focus – Part 1
Kommentaarid on kirjutatud EWR lugejate poolt. Nende sisu ei pruugi ühtida EWR toimetuse seisukohtadega.
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W. Johanson02 Sep 2022 09:45
The Anglican Church of Canada made similar proposals decades ago. Here are the results of that strategy:
https://anglicanjournal.com/go...
atfosp03 Sep 2022 18:20
Great must read article!!!
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: atfosp (17:49)
Suggestion02 Sep 2022 13:51
If every one of the 1101 signatories to the save St. Peters petition contributed $87.20 annually that would make up the lost revenue from the Salvation Army. If additional sources of revenue can be found, good for you but first of all people should put their money where there mouth is. I contribute $500 annually. Not all can but please do not sign petitions without taking responsibility for your signature.
Suggestion03 Sep 2022 07:08
Sorry. Should be their money not there money.
Agree03 Sep 2022 17:43
Signing useless petitions is easy, taking responsibility (unless you have integrity) is a little more difficult.
Hilary Amolins02 Sep 2022 17:41
Excellent analysis. I attend a United Church in my community. No permanent pastor. It works. Well. The more I read and see about Peetri Kirik, the more convinced I am that the current pastor is bleeding this church with a hubris and frankly, an ignorance that blinds him from doing what is best for the Peetri Kiriku community. If you want to survive you have to change.
To Ms Hilary02 Sep 2022 19:59
You are so gullible!! What have you done to support the Estonian churches in Toronto?
??03 Sep 2022 11:26
Can communist-freemasons be sincere Christian ministers, or are they mere EELK/EKLK careerist idealogues? Is this what the St. Peter's Council wants? "3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; 4 And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables", 2 TIM 4
atfosp04 Sep 2022 09:44
I can hear tons of Estonian speaking pastors breaking down the doors to come to serve at St. Peter's. So there should be no problem with having temporary pastors.
Hilary, your poorly though out and ignorant accusation regarding the current pastor could be construed as libel! We'll see what lawyers have to say about it!
US Esto03 Sep 2022 13:22
You Canadian Estos are unbelievable. You have these gradually manifesting financial issues with your organizations. The EM, the Church, etc. 90% of tou have spent the last 20 years pretending everything is ok or will fix itself. There are then the 10% who actually have the courage to step into leadership positions, and make the difficult decisions to impossible problems created by the fact that most would prefer to not get involved or do nothing. The people who have stepped up to serve on your respective boards (KESKUS, EH, kirikud, these people are crucified (pun intended). You go out of your way to make sure that no one will ever want to step into leadership, and for those who do, you make sure they will regret it.
Christ himself03 Sep 2022 18:57
The sad fact is that the 'impossible problems' are created by the same group of people who have been in juhatus for the last 20+ years. They ran the house (church, whatever) down without any foresight and now the only solution from this tired group of people is to sell it off. Other people (including 'friends') have tried to get involved, offer alternative solutions, they have been ridiculed and belittled. Nobody can get into the juhatus unless invited by the inner clique of the same juhatus.
To himself03 Sep 2022 20:07
Unfortunately you are the type US esto is talking about. Sit on the sidelines and only exercise your mouth. Learn from this objective opinion. We all should. Tänan US Esto for this much needed reality check.
atfosp04 Sep 2022 09:52
To "himself": the "inner clique" happens to be the congregation itself!!! 😂🤣😂
It seems you're condemning the very people you're allegedly trying to "save".
Mind boggling...
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: atfosp (09:44)
atfosp03 Sep 2022 17:49
👎This article is full of so many errors it's a waste of time to try to point them all out and correct them.
'US Esto' you'e bang on! 👍
'??' (TT) you couldn't be more hilarious!!! 🤡
Member07 Sep 2022 11:35
It is very difficult for current families to go to church together, when at least a few of the members do not speak Estonian at all. The church is no longer inclusive in that respect.

Could a rotation of prospective new pastors come who simply speak English? The English sector used to be very active and it might be popular again with changes in our demographics. If there was a rotation of prospective pastors, and attendance improved, it would be very easy to figure out who would be best to hire on a more stable basis.

I actually enjoy seeking teaching from many English speaking ones on the internet. Here is one good Lutheran one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
Simple Congregation Member07 Sep 2022 14:15
So this is your response, AFOSP, sue for libel rather than acknowledging there might be problems with a minister that does not relate well to people? A full-time minister who can barely speak English? Maybe he should go back to Estonia!

If you look out of the box, there might be interesting solutions. But the problem is, nobody wants to deal with people like you - it's very stressful. People would just rather leave - and that is very sad. Open your eyes and help save the church!
Simple Congregation Member07 Sep 2022 16:51
Not true. The problems are created by the people in the leadership positions who run the orgs like benevolent dictators. Like EM - there was no call for proposals from the community, just their options. Everyone else was drowned out.

Like Peetri kirik juhatus - it's our way or the highway - literally! One would think they would have found out about the Columbarium problem when the Future Committee studied the options and presented them for a vote! Or researched it themselves!!

Maybe the people who should be in leadership positions will not ever apply because they will be crucified! It's the other way around, US Esto!
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: Simple Congregation Member (14:15)
Fact checker08 Sep 2022 09:20
US Esto is spot on. No need to get mad at them. He's only pointing out the reality we have chosen to ignore.
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: To himself (20:07)
Challenge to Member and Simp…07 Sep 2022 17:58
A reminder that this whole issue began with 73% of the vote in September 2020 being in favour of putting the church property up for sale. This decision was taken because the cost of running the operation is not affordable. The fact is that there are not enough regular church-goers (in either language) and/or donors to fund the maintenance of the building plus a minister (even part-time). To pretend otherwise is foolish. We need to a stop allocating blame and face the facts.
Stuck in the middle08 Sep 2022 08:26
A reminder, that the vote you reference is at the centre of the controversy.

Has the board's legal team come up with a valid explanation for chopping the voting list and excluding certain members from voting that day?

The voting irregularities and the seemingly excessive compensation for a full-time minister doing a part-time job give the "friends" legitimate discussion points that they should otherwise not have.

The point made above about 'friends" not running for juhatus for fear of criticism is lame BS though. Every volunteer in every organization in our community gets bashed. Suck it up.
Stuck in the middle08 Sep 2022 20:30
Has obviously never, ever, come even close to volunteering for leadership in any organization.
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: To himself (20:07), Fact checker (09:20)
Simple Congregation Member07 Sep 2022 18:16
Did you not read the article that talks about business problems and solutions? Why is it that these issues and problems have not been discussed in detail with the congregation, along with community input and solutions? How can people possibly make an informed decision when they vote? Revenue generating ideas outside the Estonian community have never been discussed in the AGM.

We have a beautiful sanctuary, why not try to save it?
Samalt IP numbrilt on siin varem kommenteerinud: Simple Congregation Member (14:15), Simple Congregation Member (16:51)
atfosp12 Sep 2022 10:16
Yeah! Yoga classes in the Sanctuary sure ought to do it...
Give it a rest.08 Sep 2022 10:53
My god, do you lot ever make being an Estonian Canadian difficult and embarrassing. And I do mean ALL of you.
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