continuing since there was a limit on size.

I have not paid much attention over the years to the financial records of the Estonian house… and I am not a financial expert… but I would really like to know if anyone has looked into how much one would receive AFTER selling the Estonian House… example, we sell for 5 million.. if there were any write-off’s over the years then there would be recapture happening.

Also, I believe that any capital gains over all the years … means 50% of the capital gains will be taxed. Thus, how much of the 5 million will we even get? Did anyone do this calculation? Was it presented to us? I do not believe it has been presented – not sure if calculation was completed.

And really, since no one looked at the cost of “revitalizing” the old Estonian House into a “Place to be proud of” we have no cost comparisons.
We OWN the asset called the “Estonian House”. We can put a marketing plan together and we can put a mortgage on the asset to fix it up and IF we finally start to do proper marketing… we might be able to make money and start to renovate the building to a new and “hip” place to be.

Do we need visionaries yes… but even if we do not have them… we can keep what we have … finally maintain it, and in my dream… finally make a profit.
Too many variables with the move.
We OWN an asset that has VALUE and we can put together a plan for rejuvenation… get a mortgage.

Finally get staff who are competent in BUILDING maintenance and efficiencies… along with a competent marketing person…. And with our track record… I would say… stay away from hiring Estonian Friends and family since it is clear that has NOT worked out well for us.

Additionally, I have concerns with the move… for example…
• Share holders will be gone
• So WHO owns the new asset?
o The board members of Estonian house?
o Non-profit status?
o All 4 parties who are advocating for this
o If a profit venture, again.. who owns the new house?
• Who controls the funds after the sale?
• How will the new Estonian House be managed?
• Who will take out the mortgage (the liability) to pay for the New Madison House? If there is a donor of funds they can donate to the current house. (maybe the lender will own it?)
• Who pays the consultants
• Who makes sure that tenders are properly vetted and not awarded by board members (like the Architect was awarded the job)
There truly is a long list of items we really should understand before “fast tracking” this plan because the Board(s) waited too long to tell us about their plan.

Thank you Veiko Parming
It is indeed a very well written article and you are correct in so many aspects….

I found myself agreeing with you on the youth, the community and lack of visionaries. I also agree that that the Estonian House is not Pretty nor inviting nor inspiring. Yes, to all of that.
Should we have vibrant spaces… YES
Should we encourage visionaries to create exciting and enjoying events like EstDocs… and JK jazz (which I dearly miss and I would work with anyone willing to try and get that going again…) and yes, a Kovik to meet up with friends – Estonian or Not… and I too join in at events at Tartu College occasionally.
Thus, we are on the same page…. I am super happy that Estonians who marry Estonians or non-Estonians bring their children to Estonian School.. Scouts and such… Kudos… I was not so insightful when I had my children and I do regret that.
That being said… I am NOT against moving or staying.
I just feel that I lack confidence in the Boards. I feel that there are other issues. I DID vote YES to the condo deal… I did not like not having an Estonian House being torn down and nowhere to go while that happened…but I did vote YES.
I too missed board meetings due to my schedules… and thus the selling of Esto House and moving to Madison caught me by surprise. Years they said they have been working on it.
Then 18 million for a new and beautiful new building - selling Esto House and leasing back space is presented.
It believe there must be more to this story… and others have already pointed out how the Bank will finally be able to sell or earn revenue from the building they purchased on Madison. How SihtKapital can sell off houses it has purchased to help with the dwindling donations. And it seems like everyone wins in this scenario.
Thus, let me continue on my concerns over and above what others have mentioned.
Let us ponder a report that said the Estonian House useful life is over… who says that about an asset? In my experience when I have been involved in Building Assessments… the report typically outlines the deficiencies and what needs to be done and in what time line along with associated estimated costs.… not sure how any company can say… that it is past it’s useful life.. then all the buildings along University Avenue should be sold and demolished.
Age of a building does not indicate a reason to give up. The real problem for me is that the Estonian House has NOT been maintained. That means either the board members of the past either did not hire competent building managers or they did not allow the managers to get expert building assessments along the way. And thus we have a leaky building… and an incredibly OLD heating system. None of this is cost effective way of doing business.
I would say that for $150,000 you can get a new boiler (operating costs would go right down.)
I would say for $200,000 you can get a new roof at Estonian house and the building envelope would be secured.
Those are the two major things… then you can move on to redesigning spaces and start marketing it properly. Yes, we would need a mortgage that would be secured against the asset.
We then start looking for incentives/rebates for all the work… gas rebate, water use rebates, hydro rebates.. the province and the city use rebates to encourage companies and home owners to reduce consumption through efficiency.
Why over the years did none of this happen?
Again... incompetent mangers or Board members?
I truly do NOT know the answer to this. Except that is seems strange that everyone seems OK with this.
How can we be sure that the Board or the managers will do a better job going forward?

Tuleb faktile näkku vaadata, et Toronto on suurlinn. 11 Madison ja Tartu College asuvad selle südas, seega neil eestlaste keskuseks head ja halvad omadused. Tuleb meeles pidada ja arvestada keda on oodatud sealse tegevuse osalejateks.

Edaspidine areng on siis 11 Madison Ave. ja Tartu College'is nelja org'ide juhatuste vastuvõtt "Avatud uksed" 23. aprillil SAMAL AJAL kui Toronto Eesti Maja suures saalis toimub Toronto Eesti Koolikoori tulutoov kontsert, et toetada Noortelaulupeole minevaid noori!

11 Madisonile üsna lähedal asub praegu Drug and Alcohol Addiction Rehab Treatment Keskus ja sealt pisut kaugemal Transition House. Rochdale College, ka Elmar Tampõldi ehitus, “the sister building to the Tartu student residence a short distance west across Bloor Street” (Wikipedia), suleti 1975. Elasin tudengina Madison tänaval ja kolisin peatselt ära peale kuulsat mõrva juhtumit ja politsei tulekut mida filmis tol ajal CBC kaameramees Ed Väär. Endine Rochdale College on aastatega muutunud aga selge on siiski see, et selles linna rajoonis leiduks laste ja noortele hoopis teine miljöö kui on neil praegu Eesti Majas.

Kas veel edaspidine areng Toronto Eesti koolinoortele on selline, mida kirjeldab Postimees 2004a.:

"Tallinna ja teiste suuremate linnade koolimajad, kust tundide vaheajal välja ei saa ning mille uksi valvurid hoolega silmas peavad, on muutumas tavaliseks nähtuseks. Ühelt poolt võib see tunduda õpilaste õiguste piiramisena, teisalt kipub aga lihtsalt paratamatuks muutuma.

Kõikjal, eriti pealinna teatud rajoonides, lihtsalt ei ole turvaline koolimaju lahti hoida ... vargused garderoobidest, klassidest jne on muutunud igapäevaseks. Kooli lahtistest ustest võivad vabalt sisse pääseda narkodiilerid, kõikvõimalikud niisama müüjad ja asjassepuutumatud tegelased. Nii laste kui personali turvalisuse pärast peab sissepääs olema piiratud, midagi pole parata."

http://www.postimees.ee/144103...

https://cabbagetowner.com/tbt-...

Tuleb meelde Peetrikiriku jutt, nad müüsid pastori maja ära ja läksid pankrotti oma kiriku remontiga. Ma olen ainukene kes hääletas vastu.

Great analysis, Veiko. This is where I was before I saw the diminutive Madison plans with no parking and access issues. Now I’m running in the other direction and hoping that the 958 Broadview Ave will forgive me for looking at the shiny thing that Madison is. If you think that the city and the active Madison neighbourhood clan are going to let us have smooth sailing from here on in, think again. We’ll be lucky if anything gets built at all and at the fast clip at which the EH will be sold, we will have no house to fall back on.

Veiko, bless your heart. I very much value your opinion. I would like to make the observation that in my opinion, you are thinking from your perspective as a young, unattached individual. You do not have family in suburbia who will have difficulties battling downtown traffic. You are also not thinking of the younger baby boomers who are going to need easy car access to get to events. Older people do not want the crazy traffic of Bloor and Spadina and few like taking the subway. They need to feel unrushed and safe.

Why do people not rent at the EH? Because the board through the years “let it go to seed”. Constant renovations should have been a normal course of action, which is the case with successful rental facilities. Even the ROM has a modern facility jutting out of the old heritage building. We can use our imagination with our heritage building too.

Again, posting example of revamped school house on Hazelton in Yorkville (we don’t have to get this massive):
http://urbantoronto.ca/news/20...

The best and most articulate situational analysis yet. Well done.